#274 M.E
M.E
In this episode of Songwriter Trysts, Rae Leigh welcomes the incredible M.E, an artist based in Atlanta and originally from Nigeria.
M.E shares his passion for music, the piano, the teachers who have influenced his journey, faith, worship, and some of the mistakes and lessons he experienced while entering the music industry.
This is a deeply honest and vulnerable conversation. M.E bravely opens up about his history with faith and mental health, sharing personal truths that may be difficult or triggering for some listeners.
Listener discretion is advised. If any part of this conversation brings up difficult feelings or experiences for you, please consider reaching out to a trusted person or a mental health professional. If you are in immediate distress or need urgent support, contact your local crisis service or emergency hotline.
Thank you, M.E, for sharing your story with such courage and honesty.
Connect with M.E here:
Transcript
M.E
Rae Leigh: [00:00:00] Welcome to another Songwriter Trysts. I'm Rae Leigh, and we have a very special episode with M.E. M.E. All the way from Atlanta. This podcast- Yeah ... is about the intimate connection between lovers of music and songwriting. So thank you so much for jumping on and sharing a little bit of your journey with us.
I like to start with tell us a little bit about yourself. Where are you from, and how did you get into music?
M.E: I'm M.E. I'm originally from Nigeria, born and raised. Moved to the States in '03, 2003.
Rae Leigh: Okay.
M.E: Yeah, but before, before America, music was never, part of the conversation.
One thing I was pretty... I had a gift of, is pausing in time and realizing how things happened for me and why they do. Looking back now, I realize that there were moments while I was in Nigeria where I-[00:01:00]
grew a very deep connection with music at certain points in my life.
But I just never seriously 'cause I was a kid.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: So fast-forward when I moved to the States my mom had bought me a piano. And, to cut the whole story short, I heard, the first time I heard and I loved anything musically inclined was when I heard Beethoven's << ba da na >> Oh,
Rae Leigh: yeah.
M.E: I was as a young kid when she bought me that piano, I just saw the piano, realized the keys, that it was in front of me, and I literally just one finger. It was just << da na >>
Rae Leigh: did you have the demo- And, ... setting on your piano? The-
M.E: No ...
Rae Leigh: I had a keyboard- No ... and you'd press demo, and it would teach you how to play, and that was often- Yeah
one of the songs on there. No. Okay.
M.E: Now, no. So back in the day, we had this thing called VCR,
and, after watching VCRs, you have to put it in. Before the VCRs [00:02:00] could rewind the movies- ... we would have to take it out, put it on, in this machine to rewind the movies.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: And my mom would always make us rewind, put it in that, those little machines to rewind it.
But the indicator to let us know that the rewinder had stopped was Beethoven.
Rae Leigh: Oh. << Da na >>
M.E: Yes.
Rae Leigh: That's great.
M.E: Yeah. And you can imagine how much we watched movies and how much we had to hear that.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: And it ju- it just got stuck in my head.
And when I got my hands on the piano, I just << da na >> And literally- that's when everything paused, and I was like, "Maybe I have a good... maybe s- there's something here."
And fast-forward, I became the music director at my church, realized that I could sing.
Started leading praise and worship and all that stuff. And one day after college, I just told my mom I, and my parents, my dad, I was like, "I wanna do this."
So
Rae Leigh: here we are. And how did they take it?
M.E: Okay, [00:03:00] so- ... you ha- you have to take a few things into consideration. Number one, I'm African.
Number two, I'm the only boy. Okay.
Rae Leigh: I
M.E: have six sisters.
Rae Leigh: Oh.
M.E: There's a lot of pressure there to, especially with, the last name. I ha- you know, I'm the, the last name ends with me.
It's up to me to carry the last name forward- that's
Rae Leigh: pressure ... with my
M.E: seeds. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it was big pressure but as much as I was expecting them to fight back or resist or show any form of hesitation-
...
M.E: They, my dad is like just make sure you give me my child before, my grandchild before-
Before I leave this earth. You could do-" Okay. "You could go do whatever you wanna do, just make sure that you give me my boy." So my, and, I said, "Oh, that is,
Okay, okay."
Rae Leigh: Okay. Have we achieved the goal?
M.E: I'm currently married two years.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
Congratulations ...
M.E: we're still we're still enjoying the marriage.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: And [00:04:00] hopefully next year we'll start, But my dad, he's young. He, he's very- Yeah ... agile
Rae Leigh: Yeah. You've got time.
M.E: He ain't leaving this earth any time soon.
Rae Leigh: I don't know. I I, I didn't have pressure for the carrying the family name, and I do have a sister who's married to someone who has that pressure, and they haven't been able to have children unfortunately.
But I do remember that time when my mom was just getting desperate. I'm one of five, and she was kinda like- ... "I wanna have grandkids. All my siblings have grandchildren." "I don't have any grandchildren." I think she had 12 within three years. So like- Wow ... careful what you wish for. Wow.
Yeah.
M.E: Yeah. We always
Rae Leigh: said, "Yes, Mom." And,
M.E: One thing too we and we we're also kinda nervous and excited at the same time because-
Rae Leigh: Yeah ...
M.E: everything has, to this point, has been leading to us and possibly having twins.
Rae Leigh: Oh.
M.E: So yeah.
Rae Leigh: That's, you know- But...
If God wishes it. I'm a big believer in divine timing and for some reason- Yes ... I thought I'd have twins when I was younger, but I have three. But my first two- Okay ... pretty much should be twins. They were due on the same day, they're a boy/girl, and they are [00:05:00] clones, but they're two years apart. So I had-
M.E: Wow
Rae Leigh: God's grace on that, that side of things.
M.E: Yeah.
Rae Leigh: Okay. So that interesting family, and I'd love to unpack the one boy with six brothers, but I'm sure that'll come out. Tell me about your songwriting.
M.E: Six sisters.
Rae Leigh: Yeah. Sisters. Six sisters. Yeah. Yeah. I'm, I'm- And a boy ... I have one brother with four- Okay
there's four girls and one boy.
M.E: Four girls, one boy, okay. Cool.
Rae Leigh: Apparently that makes you a nice person. I heard that if you have sisters- ... it ma- there's a higher chance that you're a kinder person if you've grown up with a sister. Yes. So you have six. More, a
M.E: lot more gen- yeah. Yeah. I was, although we have father, we had a, we had, f- parents that were there.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: I, they tend to treat me more like the father and the protector because it was easy for me, for them to talk to me and-
Rae Leigh: Yeah ...
M.E: I grew older pretty fast. Yeah ... and I basically protect them, 'cause if they went to my father, it would've been a different conversation. If they went to the brother- Yeah[00:06:00]
brother would, understand a little bit and still protect,
Rae Leigh: I love that.
I have to say, I probably did the same thing to my brother. I probably I introduced my boyfriends to him first. Not my, my, not my dad. Like
Exactly. It's- yeah ... it's an interesting concept.
What what about songwriting? When did songwriting start for you? After the piano-
M.E: So-
Rae Leigh: When did we start getting some lyrics?
M.E: I spent about, a very long time at the, in, in church and- ... while I was at church I was I knew I wanted to do more. So I it's a v- I'm gonna write a book one day because I think my story is a very interesting story.
Again when I moved to the States finally, I was in North Carolina.
I went to school out there, but when I started having this urge to do music one of the things that I wanted to do was have my own setup. So I went and got a storage unit a non, basically no, no heat, no air, no nothing, just a clean storage unit A
Rae Leigh: garage, yeah
M.E: Yeah, and basically [00:07:00] built my own system in there everything, and s- and funny enough, it became one of the popular studios-
Rae Leigh: Wow ...
M.E: in North Carolina at the time.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: But what, in that studio, what, that's when I discovered my love for songwriting. Now, what I did was I started hearing artists.
I started building my repertoire with music and learning from greats, and one in particular, his name is Tank, is a R&B artist here in Atlan- in in, in the States.
And I just loved the way he sang. I just loved everything about his artistry, and I started copying, not word for word, but his style.
I started emulating his aura, his artistry and all that, and I built so much confidence that at the time I would listen to other artists and start making covers-
Rae Leigh: Yeah ...
M.E: of their song, but I would rewrite everything completely.
Rae Leigh: Okay.
M.E: And I would use their beats. I would use the same instrumental and [00:08:00] write a whole total song- Yeah
total different song.
Rae Leigh: Wow.
M.E: And then put it on MySpace, Hi5, back then. Yeah but the crazy thing is and this is, this came with me not knowing, I would title it, and don't judge me for this, but I would title it This Is How It Should Have Been Done.
Rae Leigh: Oh. It's confident.
M.E: See, I...
Listen, I, it was, now, knowing what I know now, it was a terrible idea because- ... I didn't know that those covers would blow up to become what they were at the time-
Rae Leigh: Yeah ...
M.E: to the point that they were gaining attention from the original artist that I was doing these covers from.
Rae Leigh: So-
M.E: And they would just, some of them would secretly not like me and, they would reply to the songs and stuff like that, and fortunately now I've taken all of them down because I don't want that attached to my name.
Rae Leigh: Yeah,
M.E: okay. But it's part of my story, so I had always have to- Yeah
Tell it. Yeah, I did a, I did quite a few and I got discovered on [00:09:00] Facebook by a manager at the time who managed Trey Songz, K. Michelle and he was like- I know you a artist, but you ever thought about songwriting?" And I was like, "I just wanna do music," yeah. And they brought me to Atlanta, and the rest was history.
Rae Leigh: I love that for you, and I love the confidence of the rewriting, and I think that is the best way to-
M.E: Yeah, terrible choice ...
Rae Leigh: to learn. Terrible choice. The title of This Is How It Should Have Been Done is a bit arrogant. Yeah. But I- Yeah, very ... I have to relate.
M.E: I wasn't thinking.
Rae Leigh: I think I remember, 'cause I was the worship ministries leader of my youth group as well, and I think church is a fantastic place for people like us- Yes
to learn so much- Yes ... about not just songwriting and singing and per- but performance and stage, all that stuff gets to happen- Yeah ... on a weekly basis. It's like a great little training ground. But I wasn't allowed- Absolutely ... to listen to the radio or like- ... secular music. So I secretly did, and then I re- I would rewrite the songs with Christian lyrics.
And, Wow. And it's hilar- like it's [00:10:00] cringe-worthy that I like to go back- ... and I go like, "Oh my goodness, I can't believe I wrote that." But at the same time it's that practice of working that songwriting muscle that, Yes ... I attribute that to. Yes. When did you go to... Okay, so you've come to Atlanta, you've done songwriting.
What do you think's been, like, the biggest lessons for you that you've gone, "Ah, this has really made a big difference in how I write songs and how I deliver what I'm doing as a professional?"
M.E: Probably my experience. Because again, when I was s- when I finally moved to Atlanta...
before I moved to Atlanta, I was coming... I was still at the church.
On Fridays till Sunday, I, on Friday I would leave work, drive six hours to Atlanta.
Rae Leigh: Wow.
M.E: Be there from Friday till Sunday, come back to North Carolina, repeat the same cycle. I did that for three years.
Rae Leigh: Fair enough.
M.E: Yeah.
Yeah. But I think one of the biggest for me is not realizing that the, there was a lot of business side to it that I [00:11:00] missed.
Not knowing what I knew, and me coming in the game and just songwriting and all... my motto was, "I just wanna do music. I just wanna do music." And me being mishandled, mistreated- misrepresented in so many ways put me in a state of awareness where it took me from- Attacking songs with just regular characters and messages or whatever, and just I see things differently. Like I, because of my experiences I was forced to see things differently, hear things differently, experience things differently, and it just put me in a different state of pen-ship, of
Rae Leigh: a penmanship-
M.E: where I would write songs that are directly related to what I was going through at the time.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: So I don't know if that answers your-
Rae Leigh: No, that's fantastic ... your question. And like I think it can be really hard for [00:12:00] songwriters, and I've got advice from professional songwriters who have b- worked in publishing all sorts of things, that we can be on the road and we can get so busy doing what we do that we're not writing songs about real life that, regular people can relate to anymore. And he joked- Exactly ... o- one guy joked with me about how he started just throwing out all the songs that were songwriters writing songs about writing songs and being on the road. 'Cause that's, that was all they were experiencing. So you gotta- Yes ... live your life to be able to write.
And it sounds like- Yeah ... that's, like that's what you've, you live in
M.E: practice. And, and growing up too growing up in the industry at that time as well- ... I had a lot of mentors, and they never, They didn't take it easy on me too,
Rae Leigh: yeah.
M.E: It was very, Like I had a mentor at the time called Troy Taylor.
He was a world-renow- I don't know if you n- know him, but he was a world-renowned producer. He produced and worked with, people like New Edition, Whitney Houston Babyface, Wow ... Boyz II Men. I mean- Yeah ... I was lucky enough to have him by my side, and he was like, "No, I don't like [00:13:00] it. Let's do it again.
Let's do it again." He, i- I give him some credit as well, because he was like, "Write, don't write a moment record. Write a forever record." "Write a record that you will listen to 20 years from now and it still sounds fresh, it still sounds brand new." Accredited to, o- also what I've, what I went through, which was crazy.
My, my first 10 years in the industry was I think one of the most gut-wrenching experience I've, from being broke to driving, and just writing a song that was on the radio and was getting so much attention, and I never got to, I di- I didn't know the business enough to do the paperwork right.
Rae Leigh: So what were you missing? I
M.E: even
Rae Leigh: got to the- as a warning- ... or a cautionary tale to others.
M.E: I think one of the biggest mistake I did was sign away my, when I finally signed to the same people that, brought me to Atlanta-
...
M.E: One of the [00:14:00] biggest mistakes I did was not having a lawyer to look at my contract.
That was one. And signing that what I did sign was, it was, I signed away my power of attorney.
Rae Leigh: Oh.
M.E: Which, yeah. Wow. Which means they could collect on my behalf and, you know how that was. Yeah. Basically, yeah. So they, to the point where-
Rae Leigh: In perpetuity, for a time period?
I mean-
M.E: For the time, for the duration of the contract. And even after that, after the contract was done I think they were also collecting for another six or seven years and all that stuff. Whoa. And it would had to it, the way the contract was structured was so bad-
Rae Leigh: Yeah ...
M.E: that even managers...
Imagine you as a manager signing a songwriter. I do all the work, but your name appears on the songwriter split sheets as,
Rae Leigh: as- As a manager ... as co- As a writer ...
M.E: as co-songwriters. So
Rae Leigh: it- So even your manager was [00:15:00] in on a bad contract. Yes. Misrepresentation. Yes.
M.E: So it no, they were part.
No, they were part. They were the-
Rae Leigh: Yeah, that's what I'm saying ... they were a part of the- they were part of the con. Yes. You they were both- Yeah ... yeah.
M.E: Yeah. So it was bad. So when I wa- I was lucky enough to land a very big record, which was my first song that I w- I wrote and I looked at the splits and I'm like, what are their names doing here?"
Like- Yeah ... why, I wrote this. I, you know- Yeah,
Rae Leigh: this is mine, yeah ... I,
M.E: it's mine, and that record went on to win a lot of awards- Yeah ... and also got nominated for a Grammy. And they also get a nomination- Yep ... because their name was attached on the paper. So- ... and these are the things that I'm not aware of because, again, I signed my rights away so they could literally collect my publishing, p- collect my mecha- mechanicals all my royalties-
Yeah
And they'll give me whatever they feel like giving me because they say so.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
Very trusting obviously, and loving. Yeah.
M.E: Listen, like I said, m- my, my motto [00:16:00] was, "All I wanted to do was music," and I'm never- Yeah ... saying that again. But,
Rae Leigh: I I, I don't know. You're a man of faith I'm a woman of faith, and I am a big believer in prayer, but I think one of the things that God's taught me is careful what you pray for.
... But also He's taught me to pray bigger and be more specific. Like- Yes ... I'll give you an example. I don't know if you can relate. So one of my f- my goals, I'm also an actor. Okay. And one of my prayers and goals in life was to work with Dwayne Johnson, The Rock.
M.E: Yeah.
Rae Leigh: And I literally was like, "If I could just work with The Rock once in my career, my entire life, I'll die happy," essentially.
Within a month of that prayer, I was on a TV show with The Rock, and I was singing as a songwriter. Wow. And I got to perform one of my own songs and another song. Wow. That's amazing ... and it was just, it was a small part, but it was a feature. I got my name on the project and everything like that. I can say I've worked with The Rock.
M.E: Of course, yeah.
Rae Leigh: But I felt this conviction 'cause part of me when I prayed, I was like, "This is like a 20, 30 year goal," and it happened so quickly. And my conviction was God saying, "You're not dreaming big enough." Like for one. [00:17:00] Maybe I was idolizing The Rock, I don't know. Yeah. Maybe that was like a sin. Yeah.
But it was also like I need to be more specific about what I want with my artistry and how I wanna glorify God in what I do, and that's been an interesting one for me. How has faith impacted or maybe directed your life? Have you had a moment like that where you feel like God's kinda stepped in and made a big change that's been for the best?
M.E: A lot of times. Again, with what I've been through I think one of my biggest struggle was looking myself in the mirror and saying, "I, I I failed." Because again, the first 10 years of my career was me doing work but having no proof to take back home to,
with the pressure that I already...
With the pressure of the convi- on, of the conviction of me being the only son, every day I wake up and I look at myself in the mirror, like I've been in, I've now been in Atlanta for five, six, seven, eight, nine, 10 years, and I've done a lot. But- I don't have nothing tangible to [00:18:00] show for it.
And that weighed on me so much, to the point where I started battling a lot of mental issues to the point of, I started living a life of recklessness drinking, smoking, bad eating habits.
I was dating recklessly. I was also contemplating a lot of suicidal thoughts to the point where I made even advances on, trying to take my life. And it was just me trying to get away from the pain. Yeah. And what also enhanced that also is I met another mentor. She wanted to through a networking event, and she thought I was literally the golden child, and she wanted to sign me, and she asked if I was, attached to a company now.
And she, I was like, "Yeah." And she, saw my contract, and she was like, "No."
Rae Leigh: Yeah. "
M.E: I have nothing to do with you. I don't want nothing," yeah. And imagine going through the weight of everything else, and now getting that. Yeah. And I'm like what [00:19:00] have I done?" What... i- all I wanted to do was music, but now was it, was I wrong for asking that, or was I...
so-
...
M.E: It weighed so much. And those, and the life that I chose at the time put me in a place where- It became more priority than even serving God or going to church or showing up at church and showing up for my music, showing up for my health.
To the point where it put me at a place of put me at a path of straight up just destruction.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: I remember one day, and this was the first of many one day I was having a party at my house. I had just... I decided to get a job, regular job. I was making good money. And I had a, a, a birthday party, and everybody came to my loft at the time. We had so much fun, and the next morning I woke up and my heart was like palpitating, like going 100 miles an hour.
And every time I would get up, I would get [00:20:00] dizzy and fall right back down.
Rae Leigh: Okay.
M.E: And and I did it about five times, and I couldn't get up anymore because my head was so l- light and every- the room's just spinning. And called my friend. They were able to come on time and rush me to the hospital where they did a, it's called a cardioversion.
So it's a thing where your heart beats out a rhythm.
Doubles the time of the highest high blood pressure. Wow. I don't know the medical term for it.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: So they couldn't reverse it on time, so they had to put... They had to shock you basically-
Rae Leigh: Whoa ...
M.E: to stop your heart and then restart your heart-
Rae Leigh: Ooh
M.E: so that your heart can reset. You've
Rae Leigh: been reset. You've had a heart reset. Wow.
M.E: Yes. That was the, again, like I said, first of many. I'm gonna write a book 'cause I have a very interesting story life and, it was just one of those things where it changed everything because I felt like that was a way, that was God's way of, 'cause He, I felt like He had, He was always knocking.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: And I wasn't listening. [00:21:00] Again, remember, like I said before, I have a gift for pausing in time and realizing why things happen, when they happen. But when I was living this life- I just didn't have time to pause. I would see the signs, but I would just ignore it, left my music, left my mental s- my... where I was supposed to be mentally, and I ended up d- living this life that ende- that put me in the hospital. And I think that's changed everything, but it didn't change my mental space. It only slowed down the progression of what was supposedly going bad.
And fast-forward even, I think, last year, as a result of, all of my crazy decisions in the past I... And I feel like that's what changed everything. It was another, y- top of last year, I was going through this space of not recklessly, 'cause I'm married now, you know- everything is good.
Rae Leigh: Congratulations.
M.E: But I still deal with this I still deal with this mind torment- ... of the stress of what my life could have [00:22:00] been like now if- Yeah ... and I literally decided that I was gonna stop doing music. I was gonna just-
Rae Leigh: Wow ...
M.E: get a regular life and just, just be okay with...
I know how to make money legally.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: And,
Rae Leigh: I- That's good ... it
M.E: may not come from music.
Rae Leigh: Music is legal, by the way.
M.E: Okay. Yeah. But it may not... I'm a, I'm also a con- I'm a licensed contractor, so-
Rae Leigh: Okay ...
M.E: i'm like, "I'ma just be a contractor."
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: I think I'm figuring, I'm now figuring it out, figuring out that I'm not gonna make money doing music.
So I'm okay with that.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: It's gonna be a struggle, but, and one day, I was literally just sitting there with my wife, just watching TV, and the next thing I fell asleep and woke up, and it was, like, 8:00 EMS workers just standing right in front of me with flashlights in my eyes, and my wife had recorded it.
Apparently, I was having seizures.
Rae Leigh: Oh.
M.E: And seizure, heart attack, and palpitations, all that, all at the same time. Yeah.
Rae Leigh: God is like, "Get off [00:23:00] the couch and make some music."
M.E: All
Rae Leigh: at the same time. "My people need you."
M.E: Yeah. All- "My people need you." Listen, it was- I love that ... and she recorded it because she s- apparently I've gone through it before, and I didn't believe her, 'cause you don't know- Yeah
that you're going through
Rae Leigh: something. Yeah.
M.E: But this time she recorded it while she was talking to the ambulance, to the hospital. Yeah. They came, and I woke up thought- thinking that I just woke up from a deep sleep. Asleep.
Rae Leigh: Yeah. Yeah.
M.E: But showed me the video, and I was foaming at the mouth. My eyes was rolled back.
Oh, that would've been
Rae Leigh: so scary
M.E: for you. Crazy. Yeah. And they took me straight to the hospital. I was at a hospital for seven days.
Rae Leigh: Phew.
M.E: And after that, that's when I was like, "Okay, I hear you, God." Yeah. So and I came back, and yes, I get it. I'm listening. I came home. My mind changed. My focus changed.
Everything changed. Praise God. I released my first single, and now we're sitting at two-plus million streams worldwide. Yeah. And it's the best decision that I've ever made.
Rae Leigh: I love this. And I'm happy. I did- And I cannot [00:24:00] wait to hear your book. Read your book. Read your book. I feel like we could definitely go on for a lot longer.
Let's talk about your music. You've got a new single coming out on Friday. Tell me about this project. Yeah.
M.E: So the, this, the single is called Clock Out.
Again, I'm coming from a real place. I'm a, a lo- I call myself a, a local songwriter. I try not to write for I try not to write a bigger picture.
I try to relate to- To the next man, to the next person. Even with my current single that's out right now, I Sat With It. Yeah. It's basically saying, I'm sitting with my feelings-
Rae Leigh: Yeah ...
M.E: instead of reacting and overreacting and possibly doing something that I may regret. I'm just gonna sit with it, let my thoughts process, and then a- act accordingly.
Rae Leigh: Wisdom.
M.E: The next song, Clock Out, is basically saying, it's just me telling my wife that, "You've held me down for so long, and it's time for you to clock out. I got you."
Rae Leigh: Whoa. So-
M.E: So it's me basically singing to [00:25:00] women who have who carry themselves and the world on their shoulders.
And never really get to kick their feet back- Oh ... and relax. So this is where I come in and say you've done way too much. For this one moment, just clock out- ... and not think of anything. I got it."
Rae Leigh: Yeah. "
M.E: You're good. I'll take care of it. And if you ever feel like clocking back in, it's up to you."
That is so beautiful. "I won't push you. I won't pressure you, and I got it from here."
Rae Leigh: Do you know what? And I'm a little bit old school, and I'm definitely a feminist and female empowerment, and I want women to be safe and protected, and I want children to be safe and protected. That's one of my number one goals.
Yeah. But I am so grateful. I was such a sick mother when I was pregnant. And my husband did that. He stepped in, and he went, "You know what? I got this. I'll cover the bills. I'll manage the admin-y stuff," and everything that was outside of the home. He really did. He stepped up and just took care of it, and he's been doing it for 14 years now, and he's also one of my biggest creative supporters.
Awesome ... but it's good to have a partnership like that, and- [00:26:00]
M.E: Oh, yeah ...
Rae Leigh: it doesn't mean that I have to always do the cooking and cleaning and, it's it's not that traditional. It's very shared. No. But there are some things that he's naturally strong and good at and make me feel- Exactly
taken care of as a woman and a mother. And that allows me the space to do the other things that I can do, yeah. Sewing up my kids' stuff. That's true. He d- he, we have a rule. He doesn't touch the washing or the clothes or the repairs. And I do that stuff. Okay.
M.E: I think mine is the trash.
She, she-
Rae Leigh: You do the trash.
M.E: Yeah. She said, "Babe, I'm not taking the trash out." I'm like, "You don't have to."
Rae Leigh: Or can as much. Oh. Yeah, everyone's the nails, okay.
Ooh.
M.E: Exactly. Okay.
Rae Leigh: So just playing guitar, by the way. So I don't know how Dolly Parton played the guitar with those nails. I've tried. It does not work.
Okay. So you've got new single coming out. What's the new single called?
Clock out. And the album- And
M.E: coming out
Rae Leigh: this Friday ... the album-
M.E: The album is called, the album is called, this is a good one, it's called DNA. And the meaning is don't need approval.
Rae Leigh: [00:27:00] Oh, I love that. That hits hard. That's so good.
Yeah. Did that come to you instantly or was that did that take a while to come up with?
M.E: It took a while- Yeah ... because again, it's a, it's a double entendre because again, DNA means I do this.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: Don't need approval is, is me saying that I'm back, I'm stronger. I don't need approval to be anybody in this music industry-
Rae Leigh: Yeah
M.E: that they want me to be. I'ma be myself. I'ma make the kind of music that I want, and if you like it, cool. If not, it's okay either. That's so
Rae Leigh: good. Oh, my heart's so full for you. And you've got some shows coming up. You said- Yes ... my favorite words, "I wanna come to Australia and tour." Yes, I would love to So we would love to have you over.
As long as it's not in December. Yes. We've talked about this. Not December. Too much Christmas and end of year school stuff. ... But you're gonna get your album out this year. You've got some stuff. Will we see you at the Grammys in February?
M.E: Yes.
Rae Leigh: Yes. I like to end with two questions. One is- Okay
what is one piece of advice that you would give to someone who's just starting out? Not that you haven't given heaps [00:28:00] already.
M.E: It's a two-part thing.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
M.E: Be okay saying no.
Be okay saying no. Again, not every money is good money, not every situation is a good situation, 'cause you have to protect your peace.
...
M.E: And then also the biggest thing that surrounds all of that is ownership. Ownership. Own your stuff, own your music, own your rights. If you don't know the business, learn it. Take your time. Speak to somebody. YouTube is free.
There are things out there that could help you. I was just telling somebody the other day, I said, "Music is literally 10% of the game," there's so many things out there that you're, you can use as a tool to even help you become a better songwriter, a better artist- ... a better... Take your time to nurture those parts and then come strong. Form this one big Voltron,
Rae Leigh: yeah.
M.E: And it's and that's literally the advice I give anybody.
Take your time, learn the game, learn it properly, learn the business, [00:29:00] and if you feel the need to say no.
Rae Leigh: Yeah. Tru-
M.E: Another opportunity
Rae Leigh: will
M.E: come by ... trust your instincts.
Rae Leigh: Trust your instincts. That- Trust your instincts. That's, I think, something all artists need to learn. And your other, the other question I had was, if you could work with anyone in the world, dead or alive, who would it be and why?
M.E: I m- I did scratch my... I did hit my bucket list.
Rae Leigh: Okay.
M.E: Whitney Houston.
Rae Leigh: Yeah. Wow.
M.E: Yes. I did some vocal work, some vocal production work for Whitney Houston. I was lucky enough to be in the room with her. She was working on a project at the time before she died, and she asked me, she asked the room- Yeah
for their opinion, and every... And I guess she didn't like the opinion that they were giving, and, I'm sorry, my light just automatically came on. That's okay. But she turned around and asked me for my opinion, and I said, "Listen, you're the greatest."
Rae Leigh: Yeah. "
M.E: You're one of... You're, you are the greatest.
You're not one of the greatest, you are the greatest."
Rae Leigh: Yeah. "
M.E: And right now, y- it, I, respectfully, I think it can do better
Rae Leigh: Yeah
M.E: And she respected that And how [00:30:00] did she take it?
Rae Leigh: Okay.
M.E: She respected it. Meanwhile, my management at the time was like
Rae Leigh: Yeah, what are you doing?
M.E: 'Cause with people like that, all it is yes.
Oh, it's great. It's great. It's great. And remember, I ca- I'm coming off of my little arrogant era. So I was feeling myself "I think it could be better." But I said it in a very respectful way though. Yeah. I was like, "Yeah, you... i've heard so much better, and I think you can- Yeah
I think it could be..." And she respected it, and that led me to be in the room to do some vocal work vocal production. Not vocal work, because she's still a beast.
Rae Leigh: But some vocal- You tell me you didn't get castrated for telling the truth.
M.E: Yeah. Listen, it was... Again, I'm, I know it was Whitney, but it was like everybody was like...
they want... W- So two things they told me to do. They said, after that night, the mana- We got into a big argument, and they told me, they said, "You need to send a letter of apology-
...
M.E: To them, to, to her
Rae Leigh: and her team." Oh, [00:31:00] okay. Yeah. Back up. Do... take it back. Take it back. We're gonna run out of time.
I'm so sorry. But I really appreciate how generous you've been with all of your sharings- Yeah ... and your vulnerability. It's been amazing. I'm gonna put it all up on the podcast, along with a transcript of this episode so everyone can read it and listen to it. And I cannot wait- Great
to hear your new albums, and wish you all the best. And hopefully I'll see you at, in, at the Grammys in February.
M.E: Absolutely. Thank
Rae Leigh: you for-
